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Priest: Catholics Morally Forbidden to Vote for Hillary November 1, 2016

Posted by Tantumblogo in awesomeness, Basics, catachesis, General Catholic, Glory, Grace, Interior Life, Latin Mass, manhood, priests, sanctity, Society, Tradition, true leadership, Victory, Virtue.
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What can I say?  I agree, completely.  She is, inconceivably, even worse than the present occupant of the White House in terms of moral dereliction, promotion of outwardly evil policy, propensity to persecute the Church, and personal immorality.  Hillary Clinton can and must be virulently opposed on a huge swath of issues, from her manifest support for abortion to her likely Supreme Court nominees to her support for the government’s endorsement of immoral acts to her manifest disdain for faithful Christians and her willingness to openly persecute them. We are, after all, deplorable:

The priest in the sermon directly states that Catholics are morally permitted to vote for Trump under the principle of double effect, while it is morally impermissible to vote for Hillary Clinton, and while he does not say so, I would argue that doing the latter constitutes a grievous sin due to her disastrous record and numerous statements to the effect that she will seek to expand and force the public funding of abortion in all possible circumstances.  Note he does not say it is morally obligatory to vote for Trump, only that it is permissible, with which I agree.  There are other options that are also morally permissible, though they have no chance, at all, of being elected.  It’s this last bit that finally convinced me to most likely cast my ballot for Trump, not because I am supportive of him to any real extent, but to prevent the election of somebody I find utterly unacceptable on numerous levels.  There is, in this terrible time, no perfect, or even reasonably good, alternative.

Comments

1. TheDumbOx - November 1, 2016

But cafeteria Catholics can’t be bothered by such things as holy obedience, damning emails, FBI investigations, Catholic ‘Springs’, infanticide, and other such things. After all, there is the LGBTQTUVWXYZ rainbow to support and it is just soooooo pretty!

Baseballmom - November 2, 2016

Not JUST cafeteria Catholics- even folks I know who are very orthodox are still considering hildebeast….. I honestly don’t get it….

TheDumbOx - November 2, 2016

I guess they can’t be bothered by things like, oh I don’t know, MORALITY! We live in interesting times.

Camper - November 5, 2016

If they’re that picky, they should choose the Constitution party candidate or sit out. One can’t ever vote for a Democrat under any circumstances; it’s intrinsically evil.

2. Brian E. Breslin - November 2, 2016

Tantum, I am one of of eleven siblings, and four of them are solidly Obama/ Clinton supporters. Last night hefore I went to bed I sent this homily to all ten of the others and got not one response from any of the four to this response to their Catholic consciences. Tantum, throw an extra one up tonight please for my sibs. Thanks, Brian

Baseballmom - November 2, 2016

Brian, I sent a similar sermon to my anti-Trump sibs and nephews…. not sure they are voting hildebeast, but any vote NOT for Trump is a vote for her. I did not hear back from a single one of them either…. pray for mine, I will pray for yours.

3. Magdalene - November 2, 2016

The Archbishop of Denver, Aquila, has also said that a Catholic can vote for anyone who supports abortion and went on to say that Killary is an aggressive pro-abort.

TF - November 2, 2016

Did you forget the word “not” in you sentence? I sincerely hope so.

AbortionKills3500aDay - November 2, 2016

Hoping the same!

Mrs. H. - November 2, 2016

For the record, Archbishop Aquila has said Catholics canNOT vote for those supporting abortion.

4. Joseph D'Hippolito - November 2, 2016

You send this to Mark Shea. His public apoplexy would be delightful to watch!

5. TF - November 2, 2016

Coup de’tat has been launched, but a counter coup anticipated it. Killery and Obama are going down. Please pray for our country.


Sorry if this was posted twice.

6. Michele Kerby - November 2, 2016

I was raised a Catholic, and although I’m attending a different church now, I still take Catholic teaching very seriously. I also carry a heavy burden of guilt for not attending a Catholic church. So it grieves me a great deal, especially because I feel like I’m burning my bridges back to the Catholic Church, but I just can’t vote for Trump. Past Republican presidents who seemed sincerely pro-life and had the backing of Congress either didn’t try hard enough or were unable to do anything to help the situation.

In the meantime abortion has become more politically and socially acceptable, ever more firmly entrenched in American culture. No matter how much I try to convince myself otherwise, I have difficulty believing that Trump, whose major political skill seems to be very good imitation of a just-landed fish, would have the political will or backing by Congress to succeed where some very fine politicians have failed. Increasingly I believe the pro-life battle will have to be won in the minds and hearts of Americans before it can be won in the courts or the legislative houses.

Trump, however, has said he will roll back Obamacare and deport all illegal aliens back to Mexico. These smaller battles I think he could win. Rolling back Obamacare would presumably put access to medicine back the way it was before. Like things are in Texas, where many people, innocent people, die because they can’t get decent medical care. Deporting illegal aliens would put many children, like many of my kids’ friends, back into terrible poverty, back into danger from desperate gangs who fight on the street and don’t care if innocents get in their way. Any decent parent would do what their parents did to try to save them. I know I would.

Certainly abortion is immoral in a special way, and stopping it is the only moral choice. But the other outcomes are immoral as well, and far, far more likely. I hate it down to the roots of my soul but I can’t see any other moral way than to do as little harm as I possibly can. Tantum, if you can convince me otherwise, I pray to God that you would do so.

Tim - November 2, 2016

Come back to the Church, you will not regret it. I know from personal experience. As far as voting for Trump……you really must as we all must. Hillary is satanic ndlasaletteboys@yahoo.com must be stopped. Constantine was the vessel that God gave the Church to be released from the grip of the Roman persecution. He was hardly pure as the driven snow. Saint Peter denied Christ 3 times. St. Augustine was a terrible sinner for years. He is now a Doctor of the Church. It is good to have high standards but don’t cut your nose off despite your face. Trump is the alternative to Hillary that God has allowed. One of these 2 will be elected next Tuesday. Trump is not a perfect vessel but he’s the only alternative to Satan incarnate that we have. It is a moral imperative that ALL Christians vote for Trump so we can slay the beast. Voting 3rd party or not at all is a sin of omission this time around. This is the last chance to save our nation and Trump is it. The Holy Spirit is calling you back, follow His lead.
God bless you.

Tim - November 2, 2016

I have know idea how the email address got in there. It should be the word “and”.

c matt - November 2, 2016

I don’t know if you are saying you will vote for Hildebeast, bust as mentioned above, there is no question voting for her is a sin. There is room for debate whether one may simply abstain from voting.

So let’s debate. You seem to base opposition to voting for Trump on three grounds (1) although he talks pro-life, he doesn’t seem sincere, or even if he is, past Republican presidents have done little to influence it; (2) he would deport illegals; and (3) he would lessen access to medical care.

(1) He may very well not be able to anything about abortion, which would make him no different from any other GOP president. The only thing he has some control over is SCOTUS appointments, who he at least has indicated are pro-life. We know what Hildebeast’s are. There is a high likelihood that at least two SCOTUS will be appointed during the next term, so we are faced with the certainty of disastrous appointments by the Beast vs. a shot at decent appointments by Trump. Advantage Trump.

(2) Immigration is largely in the hands of Congress although it is true Trump does have the executive duty to enforce the laws. As a practical matter, it would be darn near impossible to deport the vast majority of illegals, and they usually only come in contact with law enforcement when committing a crime. Trump will have his hands full just trying to deport the ones who commit felonies, much less trying to round up the rest. Both parties want some form of amnesty or other immigration reform (the Dems to increase their voter share; the GOP to keep labor cheap) so it is highly unlikely Trump will be able to accomplish much here. Tie.

(3) Obamacare is dead. It was designed to fail (as Wikileaks now confirms) and it will fail because it was based upon economic fallacies (that insurance companies would agree to insure people without assessing the risks and adjusting costs accordingly). What comes in its place is a return to prior status, where a larger portion of the country was insured at somewhat expensive cost, which subsidized the care that, under federal law, was provided to those who could not afford care for emergency care and active labor (EMTALA). Little known secret: These people also got adequate care through several private small clinics scattered throughout barrios where they pay cash for services at generally reasonable costs. Or, we get saddled with a government plan where everyone (except members of Congress and other favored groups who can exempt themselves) is covered at third world standards (no better than the place these people left). I know and am related to several physicians, and while generally good people, they will not give up their 7,000 sq ft houses and BMWs in order to be paid a government salary, especially after years of med school and $100k+ in student debt. The free market at work. The best and brightest will go to other professions which are more lucrative (Banksters or politicians). Trump gives a shot at a return to the previous structure which, after all, provided the best care in the world, and I did not see immigration “dry up” because our prior healthcare was allegedly “lousy.” Clinton will intentionally blow up the system so she can implement Single-Payor-for-Thee but-not-for-Me. Advantage Trump.

There is probably nothing that will convince you if you are not already persuaded by the fact that Hildebeast would dismember live children, hide and excuse rape, foment war if the highest bidder requests it, leave our own to defend themselves when attacked (after all, what does it matter?), is backed by the elites (both parties, the MSM, and globalist leaders) and would destroy the integrity of both the legal and the electoral system to ensure her own power. She may also cheat at cards. If you can sleep at night knowing you did not do all you could to prevent her from being elected to the most powerful secular position on the planet, so be it.

c matt - November 2, 2016

“The free market at work” was supposed to go after the mention of the barrio clinics.

Michele Kerby - November 3, 2016

I see you are knowledge about medical care, but I would like to correct one of your points. Although I don’t live in a barrio, my family is very poor and I use one of the clinics you mention. They try hard, but the care is far from adequate. No doctors, just nurse practitioners and the barest minimum of tests. Basically it’s early twentieth-century medicine. I fully realize that if I should contract some serious illness, such as cancer or heart disease, there’s little chance of catching it until too late.Not that I could get proper treatment even if it were caught in time, cancer treatment for the poor here in Texas is very hit-and-miss.

Like everything else in this world, single-payer is far from perfect. But for the less well off it provides a much higher level of care, and those with more resources can still pay their own way.

Live children are already being dismembered. That’s nothing new. Clinton did defend a rapist in court because that was her job but so far as I know she never hid him. I don’t know what you mean by leaving “our own to defend themselves” means. Both candidates have cheated so badly in various ways it’s a moot point. As for the rest, I just don’t know.

I don’t think I’ll be able to sleep well voting for either candidate. I may feel nauseous after voting, as I did when I voted for Reagan. But I will vote. I’ll just have to follow my conscience and pray I’m doing the right thing.

c matt - November 3, 2016

I was referring to her husband, not the defendant she represented.

c matt - November 3, 2016

“our own to defend themselves” was a reference to Benghazi.

c matt - November 3, 2016

I suppose the level of care in barrio clinics will vary, but where I am in Texas they do have physicians, and the care is reasonable. Cancer treatment is a whole different level, and if Clinton was not so anti-religious, places like St. Jude’s could do more.

Camper - November 5, 2016

Single payer is absolutely tyrannical and the short route to a Gattica-type world in which sick people are killed because they are a burden. The answer is to loosen the academic standards for doctors. Not the real standards – just make the American educational system more flexible, so that one doesn’t have to spend eight years after junior high before one enters medical school. The system we have for training doctors is abusive and was devised by doctors to make medical care expensive.

Michele Kerby - November 7, 2016

Single payer has been available in nearly all first world countries for a long time and no mass killings have occurred. Even in countries where euthanasia is legal people aren’t exactly lining up in droves for it. Actually I would think that greater access to proper medication and nursing care, along with the more liberal family time off for workers in many of these countries, would make sick relatives much less of a burden.

Making it easier and less expensive for people to become doctors might help a lot, but I think it’s much less likely to happen here than single payer health care, which is saying a lot.

fed up - November 3, 2016

Attention Catholic Church “leaders” and Americans — One more time. It is NOT our responsibility to take care of so many of Mexico’s people. They are a Catholic nation, supposedly, it is their responsibility. Especially now that Mexicans are the fattest people on the globe surpassing Americans. And now that so many US factories and jobs have moved south of the border. Anyone else give out Halloween candy ? No, I suppose not on a TLM blog. Well, if anyone did have you checked the last several years at least where it is made ? Lots of it is now made in Mexico, even classic American stuff ex. Brach’s candy corn.

Since we do let so many from that country in both legally and illegally and if they’re going to stay, we need to DEMAND more say and influence in how Mexico is run. Yes, a role surpassing our current influence as a world leader. They seem to have absolutely no respect for us.

A Mom - November 4, 2016

Dear Michele, I am certainly no theologian but I would like to respond to you in all charity – one woman’s heart to another. The guilt you carry is, in part, your soul crying out for the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ – He Who gives life to our souls. Because you were raised in His Church and united to Him in your youth, you now recognize that loss deep down and your soul starves without Him. That same guilt, however, also carries great hope because it means that you can hear His Divine Heart calling you back home. I don’t know where you are, but seek out a doctrinally faithful priest (a Traditional Catholic priest if possible) to help you work through your situation. I would also suggest that you go to Mass (TLM if you are able). Although you can’t receive Communion, you can still just be in His Presence with an open heart. Offer yourself and your will to Him, and make it your constant prayer to be united to Him in Truth.

As for voting, I am not looking forward to it either. It may help, however, to try to look at things from a spiritual rather than a worldly perspective. After all, “our wrestling is not against flesh and blood; but against principalities and power.” Abortion is not only the murder of a child, but it is also purposely preventing that child from being Baptized and washed clean of Original Sin. It is separating that soul – forever – from the Beatific Vision. The other scenarios you present are indeed horrible and heartbreaking, and I don’t look upon the suffering that they entail lightly, but as long as one is alive there is hope for Salvation; and that is the very reason that every one of us is born into this vale of tears. “Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His justice, and all these things shall be added unto you.”

I sincerely hope that you have not taken offense to anything that I have written to you. I will remember you in my prayers, especially before the Blessed Sacrament. May God bless you and our Blessed Mother wrap her mantle around you.

Michele Kerby - November 7, 2016

won’t bore you with all the details but there are a number of reasons, spiritual, psychological and practical, why even though a part of me would like to return to the Church, it’s unlikely in the foreseeable future. (Among several other reasons, I live in a very small town where the nearest Catholic church is some twenty miles away. I can’t afford the gas or the wear and tear on the car to get there, and there are very few, if any, Catholics in town.)

But thank you so much for the prayers anyway. I do believe in miracles, and if it’s God’s will perhaps something will change.

7. Gc5341 - November 2, 2016

My sisters, uncles, aunts, cousins, and several friends will vote for Hillary. My wife and parents support Trump.

My family lives out of town and had gathered together at my parents house to eat dinner after attending a Mass remembering my late Grandpa.

The family used this opportunity to aegue with my 72 year old Dad about the election. Dad presented the pro life arguments the priest in this video made. It fell on deaf ears. They are entrenched and unmoveable in support of Hillary.

The only saving grace was my nephew a 7th grader who later told my Dad that he felt bad and wanted to speak up to defend his Grandfather’s position but was afraid of being seen as disrespectful to his parents and the rest of the family supporting Hillary. Perhaps there is hope that when he grows up he will vote pro life.

c matt - November 2, 2016

Ours seems to be the opposite. Most will vote for Trump, even my somewhat progressive leaning sister. Unfortunately, my very left leaning new daughter-in-law is a Hildebeaster. Fortunately, she is on her honeymoon, and may not get a chance to vote.

8. The Lord's Blog - November 2, 2016

Reblogged this on Jean'sBistro2010's Blog and commented:
Definitely…..

9. Magdalene - November 2, 2016

OOPS from above: Of course Archbishop Aquila said we can NOT, as in never, ever vote for someone aggressively pro-abortion murder. And he made mention that Killary is one such.

David - November 2, 2016

Bishop Murphy from the Diocese of Rockville Center (NY- it’s basically Long Island) made a recent statement about voting that was short and to the point. He didn’t say Hillary was evil, and didn’t use her name, but he did call out Catholics to vote for who will be best for the Church and her teaching.

10. Janet Baker - November 4, 2016

Just as the decision to vote for Trump must be examined by the Principle of Double Effect, so too must the decision to refrain from voting for Trump be subject to the same moral scrutiny. The decision to withhold votes from Trump does not pass moral muster. I believe that it is morally incumbent on Catholics to cast their votes for Trump.


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