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Pope Francis Ally: muslims who become Christian should be killed July 21, 2016

Posted by Tantumblogo in Basics, different religion, disaster, Ecumenism, error, Francis, General Catholic, Holy suffering, horror, martyrdom, persecution, scandals, self-serving, the struggle for the Church.
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Via Mahound, the kind of interreligious dialogue that muslims appreciate – conversion for Christians to islam is just peachy, but muslims who convert to Christianity must be killed (my comments):

Two months ago, Pope Francis welcomed Sheik Ahmed el-Tayeb, – the Grand Imam of Al-Azhar University in Cairo, and the highest scholarly authority in Sunni Islam – to the Vatican.

And a week ago, the Pope sent a representative to Al-Azhar as a follow-up and to “relaunch dialogue.”

The original meeting, which included discussions between larger delegations from Al-Azhar and the Vatican, was characterized as extremely friendly – a sort of “re-set” of Catholic-Muslim relations after the iciness allegedly set off by Pope Benedict’s Regensburg remarks in 2006…….

……..The Pope gave Sheik el-Tayeb a number of gifts including a copy of Laudato si. [Oh I’m sure Tayeb read that with bated breath.  Cover to cover in a night, for sure.  In reality, it probably went in the fire]

Then they spontaneously embraced.

…….

However, as the Cairo Institute for Human Rights Studies recently pointed out (as highlighted by Raymond Ibrahim in a recent essay), el-Tayeb has a history of saying one thing to Western audiences and another to Arabic or Muslim ones. [No, really?!?]

For example, during this past Ramadan, el-Tayeb reaffirmed on his television show that Islam mandates death for apostates:

Contemporary apostasy presents itself in the guise of crimes, assaults, and grand treason, so we deal with it now as a crime that must be opposed and punished…. Those learned in Islam [al-fuqaha] and the imams of the four schools of jurisprudence consider apostasy a crime and agree that the apostate must either renounce his apostasy or else be killed.

The plucky Institute made a public statement calling on him to renounce this position, also making the general observation that
Al Azhar adopts two contradictory speeches: one is open and directed externally, while the other supports violent extremism, and is directed internally. [It’s called taqqiyah, or “holy lying,” and is sanctioned by the Koran.  Basically any immoral behavior is sanctioned, provided it is directed towards the house of war, or the infidel.  That’s us.  Muslims are actually called to lie to the infidel in order to weaken their resistance to islam and bring them into the ummah, or islamic world.  That can be achieved by relatively peaceful means, but since that rarely happens, it is usually down to war and violent repression.]
Interestingly, it appears that the statement was not released in English or referenced on the English version of the site.

What are we to make of this? [Taqqiyah]

Is Pope Francis aware that his new Muslim friend appears to believe that apostates from Islam should be killed? How does this comport with the “protection” of Christians in the region? Or perhaps the Pope, in his rejection of “proselytism,” does not believe that Christian converts are worthy of protection, or should not be placed in the category of “Christians.” Maybe it’s more of an ethnic category.
Also, converts do tend to be a bit conservative, after all. [Heh.  Great point]
Actually, I suspect the Pope has no idea what el-Tayeb really believes or more to the point, doesn’t really care. But he does seem to care very much about publicizing how dialogue with his quasi-peer distinguishes him from his predecessor……[It’s all about the agenda, which has little to do with islam, and everything to do with internal Church politics, remaking the Church according to Francis’ vision]
…..In fairness to el-Tayeb, as the highest Sunni Muslim scholarly authority in the world it would be difficult if not impossible for him to declare to a Muslim audience that apostates shouldn’t be put to death, as this is clearly stated in the Koran, the Hadith and Islamic history and tradition. [In other words, it’s a hardcore islamic doctrine and not subject to reform without encountering immense resistance.  Thus, the taqqiyah] In that context, advocating the death penalty for apostates is not an unusual or extreme position at all. Indeed, polls show that most Muslims in Egypt support it. Though, again, there is a tradition of not, as it were, making a big deal of this to Western audiences………

……..The problem with Islam is not that all Muslims are evil. It’s that all Muslims are to one degree or another beholden to an evil ideology. Many Muslims (including most women) are enslaved to it.

So, why don’t they just leave?

See above.

Who speaks for them?

Not Pope Francis, obviously.

Sorry to say, but that much is certainly true.  Francis’ defense of persecuted Christians has appeared disinterested and pro forma, to say the least.  But someone should remind him it is his solemn duty as the Vicar of Christ to speak for and defend all Christians, including non-Catholics, and even those wicked, nasty conservative ones.

How could any reasonable Christian-muslim dialogue occur on anything like an even or rational basis, when one of the religions in question preaches death to the infidel and those who convert from it? That is to say, what kind of dialogue could occur, other than one based on Christian surrender?  Is that not what many perceive this dialogue to be – the Church surrendering to islam for the sake of sexular pagan plaudits, or at least to serve a worldly ideology?

And to think this is the same Church as St. Pius V, Saint Fernando III, or Urban II.  Or…..???

I know. Water is wet.  But I gotta write about something.  I can’t come up with 20 original posts a week!

Comments

1. Faith of Our Fathers - July 21, 2016

If Francis wants to be buddies with the Moslems then that’s up to him and him alone just leave the rest of us Catholics who know that Islam is evil and dirty to the core out of it . I personally have no Moslem friends and I personally don’t want any Moslem friends. Nor do I want to visit or see any of their Mosks. Nor do I buy anything from their shops. They clearly hate us as has been their mandate for centuries.Just a few years ago when that nobody Salman Rushdie wrote some book and they put a Fatwa on him one of the Moslem spokesman over here a guy who used to be a Pop Star Cat Stevens ( turned Moslem) said it was a Moslems duty to kill Rushdie . Now I don’t know where this guy Rushdie is or if he is -was a Moslem I don’t really care. What I did care about was it cost us £millions to watch this guy Policemen guarding him night and day for years . The point am trying to make here is this guy Stevens publicly called for Rushdie to be killed yet their wasn’t a thing done to him,as he said he was within his rights as a Moslem to say such things. Am sure we’re all mighty sick and fed up about what is within Moslems rights ,as you say Tantum they only care about themselves.


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